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	<title>Comments on: More Delmon-Hating From Gardy</title>
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	<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/</link>
	<description>Mismanaging games since 2002</description>
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		<title>By: Schulte</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1282</link>
		<dc:creator>Schulte</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:55:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1282</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Cuddyer to third solves a lot of problems. If Young, Gomez or Span get hurt or need a day off, Cuddyer gets tossed into right field again. In comes Buscher, Harris or Punto. They&#039;ll keep the spot warm until you&#039;re back...man, that&#039;s too smart.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cuddyer to third solves a lot of problems. If Young, Gomez or Span get hurt or need a day off, Cuddyer gets tossed into right field again. In comes Buscher, Harris or Punto. They&#8217;ll keep the spot warm until you&#8217;re back&#8230;man, that&#8217;s too smart.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: sirsean</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1280</link>
		<dc:creator>sirsean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:16:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1280</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think even solving 3B means we don&#039;t have to go as offensive-minded in the OF. (Again, it&#039;s acceptable to lose some SS offense as long as the SS defense is good.)&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;And by &quot;solving&quot; 3B I mean having an adequate defender (not Buscher or Harris) who&#039;s also at least adequate offensively (not Buscher or Harris). It seems to me that the real options are Casey Blake and Michael Cuddyer. And I really don&#039;t like the idea of signing Blake.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Moving Cuddyer to third solves the 3B problem, which means it&#039;s okay to lose some offense in favor of defense in CF. AND it means we have exactly the right number of outfielders. AND there&#039;s a backup plan in case someone gets injured (ie, everyone&#039;s still on the roster).&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Is there something I&#039;m missing?&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think even solving 3B means we don&#8217;t have to go as offensive-minded in the OF. (Again, it&#8217;s acceptable to lose some SS offense as long as the SS defense is good.)</p>

<p>And by &#8220;solving&#8221; 3B I mean having an adequate defender (not Buscher or Harris) who&#8217;s also at least adequate offensively (not Buscher or Harris). It seems to me that the real options are Casey Blake and Michael Cuddyer. And I really don&#8217;t like the idea of signing Blake.</p>

<p>Moving Cuddyer to third solves the 3B problem, which means it&#8217;s okay to lose some offense in favor of defense in CF. AND it means we have exactly the right number of outfielders. AND there&#8217;s a backup plan in case someone gets injured (ie, everyone&#8217;s still on the roster).</p>

<p>Is there something I&#8217;m missing?</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1279</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:07:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1279</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;I think all this crap about the problem in the outfield is a ruse to keep us from talking about the complete disaster that is the left side of the infield.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Agreed.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&quot;As the roster stands&quot; was referring to Span/Cuddyer/Young/Gomez/Kubel as the OF options. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Unfortunately the left side of the infield is a black hole offensively and defensively. The Twins already more or less sacrifice two spots in the order on 3B and SS. Why make it more painful than it has to be by sacrificing a 3rd?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I understand the need for defense, though sometimes I feel people give it too much emphasis. If he can spend some time at AAA and turn himself into even an average hitter, great (assuming he also learns how to hit the cut off). As far as 2009 is concerned, I think you have to go with offensive production. Maybe I&#039;ll change my mind if they can shore up 3B/SS - then having Gomez in the lineup isn&#039;t such a liability.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I think all this crap about the problem in the outfield is a ruse to keep us from talking about the complete disaster that is the left side of the infield.&#8221;</p>

<p>Agreed.</p>

<p>&#8220;As the roster stands&#8221; was referring to Span/Cuddyer/Young/Gomez/Kubel as the OF options. </p>

<p>Unfortunately the left side of the infield is a black hole offensively and defensively. The Twins already more or less sacrifice two spots in the order on 3B and SS. Why make it more painful than it has to be by sacrificing a 3rd?</p>

<p>I understand the need for defense, though sometimes I feel people give it too much emphasis. If he can spend some time at AAA and turn himself into even an average hitter, great (assuming he also learns how to hit the cut off). As far as 2009 is concerned, I think you have to go with offensive production. Maybe I&#8217;ll change my mind if they can shore up 3B/SS &#8211; then having Gomez in the lineup isn&#8217;t such a liability.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: sirsean</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1278</link>
		<dc:creator>sirsean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:42:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1278</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;There are a few places on the field where you&#039;re willing to sacrifice offense for defense -- typically, up the middle.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Hunter&#039;s 105 OPS+ isn&#039;t bad for a center fielder, and bear in mind that if we use him as a ceiling, then there&#039;s also a 122 and 124 in there. Those are superstar numbers from a CF.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I&#039;m not opposed in any way to improving the offense (in fact, that&#039;s a necessary and important goal), but CF, SS and C are the positions where it&#039;s at least acceptable to give up a little at the plate for a lot in the field. We&#039;re lucky enough to not have to make that sacrifice at C because of Mauer, but it&#039;s not realistic to expect that at every up-the-middle position.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;That said, I still think giving him some shelf-time at AAA for seasoning would be a good thing.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;And what do you mean &quot;as the roster stands?&quot; It&#039;s not like other offensive underachievers are actually good in the field. I&#039;d rather have Gomez than Buscher, Harris, Punto, Tolbert, Pridie, et cetera. At least he can field his position; those guys are a liability at the plate AND in the field.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I think all this crap about the problem in the outfield is a ruse to keep us from talking about the complete disaster that is the left side of the infield.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are a few places on the field where you&#8217;re willing to sacrifice offense for defense &#8212; typically, up the middle.</p>

<p>Hunter&#8217;s 105 OPS+ isn&#8217;t bad for a center fielder, and bear in mind that if we use him as a ceiling, then there&#8217;s also a 122 and 124 in there. Those are superstar numbers from a CF.</p>

<p>I&#8217;m not opposed in any way to improving the offense (in fact, that&#8217;s a necessary and important goal), but CF, SS and C are the positions where it&#8217;s at least acceptable to give up a little at the plate for a lot in the field. We&#8217;re lucky enough to not have to make that sacrifice at C because of Mauer, but it&#8217;s not realistic to expect that at every up-the-middle position.</p>

<p>That said, I still think giving him some shelf-time at AAA for seasoning would be a good thing.</p>

<p>And what do you mean &#8220;as the roster stands?&#8221; It&#8217;s not like other offensive underachievers are actually good in the field. I&#8217;d rather have Gomez than Buscher, Harris, Punto, Tolbert, Pridie, et cetera. At least he can field his position; those guys are a liability at the plate AND in the field.</p>

<p>I think all this crap about the problem in the outfield is a ruse to keep us from talking about the complete disaster that is the left side of the infield.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1277</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:33:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1277</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s tough to get excited over a comparision to a career 105 OPS+ hitter. As the roster stands there is no way I&#039;d want his bat in the lineup again. There is no doubt that Gomez significantly upgrades the outfield defense as a whole, but I&#039;d much rather go with superior offensive production until he puts up some solid numbers in AAA (which probably won&#039;t happen since he&#039;ll be the opening day CF and #9 hitter).&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s tough to get excited over a comparision to a career 105 OPS+ hitter. As the roster stands there is no way I&#8217;d want his bat in the lineup again. There is no doubt that Gomez significantly upgrades the outfield defense as a whole, but I&#8217;d much rather go with superior offensive production until he puts up some solid numbers in AAA (which probably won&#8217;t happen since he&#8217;ll be the opening day CF and #9 hitter).</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: sirsean</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1276</link>
		<dc:creator>sirsean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:19:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1276</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Oh, we&#039;re definitely not getting a serviceable shortstop for Kubel.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;We&#039;re not getting anyone from anybody unless we give up Slowey and/or Span. All the rumors involving the Twins include the following text:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&quot;[Insert team name here] is demanding Kevin Slowey and Denard Span in return.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, we&#8217;re definitely not getting a serviceable shortstop for Kubel.</p>

<p>We&#8217;re not getting anyone from anybody unless we give up Slowey and/or Span. All the rumors involving the Twins include the following text:</p>

<p>&#8220;[Insert team name here] is demanding Kevin Slowey and Denard Span in return.&#8221;</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: sirsean</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1275</link>
		<dc:creator>sirsean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:17:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1275</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Yes, I can see them doing that, and I&#039;ll tell you why:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;There&#039;s the possibility that it could damage him mentally and destroy his confidence. Since he&#039;s young and talented, Gardy would absolutely LOVE to do that.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s not just the 10 extra plays Gomez makes over Span in CF. It&#039;s also the 30 extra plays Span makes over Cuddyer, or the 50 extra plays Span makes over Delmon. Gomez makes the outfield defense A LOT better, and for a team of strike throwing fly ball pitchers who don&#039;t miss bats, that&#039;s extremely important.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Juan Pierre&#039;s a really low ceiling. Dare I point out that when Torii Hunter was 22 years old, he was a similar player with similar stats? It&#039;s also possible that Gomez is the next Hunter, except with the speed of a mongoose.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I can see them doing that, and I&#8217;ll tell you why:</p>

<p>There&#8217;s the possibility that it could damage him mentally and destroy his confidence. Since he&#8217;s young and talented, Gardy would absolutely LOVE to do that.</p>

<p>It&#8217;s not just the 10 extra plays Gomez makes over Span in CF. It&#8217;s also the 30 extra plays Span makes over Cuddyer, or the 50 extra plays Span makes over Delmon. Gomez makes the outfield defense A LOT better, and for a team of strike throwing fly ball pitchers who don&#8217;t miss bats, that&#8217;s extremely important.</p>

<p>Juan Pierre&#8217;s a really low ceiling. Dare I point out that when Torii Hunter was 22 years old, he was a similar player with similar stats? It&#8217;s also possible that Gomez is the next Hunter, except with the speed of a mongoose.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1274</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:14:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1274</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;Well, I don’t think the Santana trade was THAT bad. We also got the best defensive center fielder in baseball, who happens to be 22 years old and has plenty of development left in him. Also a couple of spare parts for the pitching staff. Also we got out from under having to worry about the What-will-happen-with-Santana drama during the season — did you see how the Indians immediately got better after they unloaded Sabathia and escaped from those questions? I’d rather have gotten more, but it’s not like we got robbed. Would you rather have paid him for 2008 and then got the draft picks? Would you rather have traded him at midseason for a minor league outfielder and a PTBNL?&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Maybe I wasn&#039;t clear enough with my point. I&#039;m not questioning the result of the Santana trade. All I&#039;m saying is if that&#039;s all Minnesota got for one of the game&#039;s best pitchers, why on earth would anybody (Erica) think we could get a SS of value for Kubel?&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Well, I don’t think the Santana trade was THAT bad. We also got the best defensive center fielder in baseball, who happens to be 22 years old and has plenty of development left in him. Also a couple of spare parts for the pitching staff. Also we got out from under having to worry about the What-will-happen-with-Santana drama during the season — did you see how the Indians immediately got better after they unloaded Sabathia and escaped from those questions? I’d rather have gotten more, but it’s not like we got robbed. Would you rather have paid him for 2008 and then got the draft picks? Would you rather have traded him at midseason for a minor league outfielder and a PTBNL?&#8221;</p>

<p>Maybe I wasn&#8217;t clear enough with my point. I&#8217;m not questioning the result of the Santana trade. All I&#8217;m saying is if that&#8217;s all Minnesota got for one of the game&#8217;s best pitchers, why on earth would anybody (Erica) think we could get a SS of value for Kubel?</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1273</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:10:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1273</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;Carlos Gomez should start the season in Rochester.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Can you honestly see them doing that? That would be the best option, but Gardy has some strange fetish with players that run fast &amp; can&#039;t hit. I&#039;ll take offensive production over the 10 extra plays per year Gomez would make in CF over Span.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I can&#039;t project Gomez into anything other than Juan Pierre at the plate. Obviously he&#039;s better defensively, but like you said, if he can&#039;t make his throws - who cares?&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Carlos Gomez should start the season in Rochester.&#8221;</p>

<p>Can you honestly see them doing that? That would be the best option, but Gardy has some strange fetish with players that run fast &amp; can&#8217;t hit. I&#8217;ll take offensive production over the 10 extra plays per year Gomez would make in CF over Span.</p>

<p>I can&#8217;t project Gomez into anything other than Juan Pierre at the plate. Obviously he&#8217;s better defensively, but like you said, if he can&#8217;t make his throws &#8211; who cares?</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: sirsean</title>
		<link>http://firegardy.com/2008/12/04/more-delmon-hating-from-gardy/comment-page-1/#comment-1272</link>
		<dc:creator>sirsean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 19:10:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firegardy.com/?p=232#comment-1272</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well, I don&#039;t think the Santana trade was THAT bad. We also got the best defensive center fielder in baseball, who happens to be 22 years old and has plenty of development left in him. Also a couple of spare parts for the pitching staff. Also we got out from under having to worry about the What-will-happen-with-Santana drama during the season -- did you see how the Indians immediately got better after they unloaded Sabathia and escaped from those questions? I&#039;d rather have gotten more, but it&#039;s not like we got robbed. Would you rather have paid him for 2008 and then got the draft picks? Would you rather have traded him at midseason for a minor league outfielder and a PTBNL?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;But the point doesn&#039;t change. We&#039;re not going to get that much for Kubel. He&#039;s not an intriguing young prospect any more, and he&#039;s not an established veteran. Those are the two things people will pay for. That&#039;s why Cuddyer draws more interest -- established veteran. That&#039;s why Span draws more interest -- intriguing prospect. Kubel draws no interest because he hasn&#039;t done anything and he&#039;s been around long enough that it seems like he should have. (But Gardy hasn&#039;t given him the chance to.)&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I don&#8217;t think the Santana trade was THAT bad. We also got the best defensive center fielder in baseball, who happens to be 22 years old and has plenty of development left in him. Also a couple of spare parts for the pitching staff. Also we got out from under having to worry about the What-will-happen-with-Santana drama during the season &#8212; did you see how the Indians immediately got better after they unloaded Sabathia and escaped from those questions? I&#8217;d rather have gotten more, but it&#8217;s not like we got robbed. Would you rather have paid him for 2008 and then got the draft picks? Would you rather have traded him at midseason for a minor league outfielder and a PTBNL?</p>

<p>But the point doesn&#8217;t change. We&#8217;re not going to get that much for Kubel. He&#8217;s not an intriguing young prospect any more, and he&#8217;s not an established veteran. Those are the two things people will pay for. That&#8217;s why Cuddyer draws more interest &#8212; established veteran. That&#8217;s why Span draws more interest &#8212; intriguing prospect. Kubel draws no interest because he hasn&#8217;t done anything and he&#8217;s been around long enough that it seems like he should have. (But Gardy hasn&#8217;t given him the chance to.)</p>]]></content:encoded>
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