Comments on: Mijares and the Adventure in Venezuela http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/ Mismanaging games since 2002 Tue, 07 Feb 2012 18:37:28 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: sirsean http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1686 sirsean Fri, 30 Jan 2009 21:55:58 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1686 <p>FunBobby: True.</p> FunBobby: True.

]]> By: sirsean http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1684 sirsean Fri, 30 Jan 2009 21:53:34 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1684 <p>I think you're missing the gap between "not being actively jerked around" and "given significant trust."</p> <p>Example: In 2007, Gardy refused to skip Ramon Ortiz in the rotation, because he didn't want to mess with his head; it was better, he thought, to keep Ortiz on his schedule no matter what. Consequently, he repeatedly skipped Baker's spot in the rotation despite the fact that he was a rookie and by definition less able to deal with getting off his schedule like that -- AND his ERA was about twice as high when he had a longer than normal rest between starts, AND when he was on normal rest his ERA was better than Ortiz's.</p> <p>This is what Gardy does -- coddle mediocre veterans while actively setting up younger players to fail. I'm not saying a young player should just be given a starting spot no matter what, but they should be given a reasonable chance to succeed.</p> I think you’re missing the gap between “not being actively jerked around” and “given significant trust.”

Example: In 2007, Gardy refused to skip Ramon Ortiz in the rotation, because he didn’t want to mess with his head; it was better, he thought, to keep Ortiz on his schedule no matter what. Consequently, he repeatedly skipped Baker’s spot in the rotation despite the fact that he was a rookie and by definition less able to deal with getting off his schedule like that — AND his ERA was about twice as high when he had a longer than normal rest between starts, AND when he was on normal rest his ERA was better than Ortiz’s.

This is what Gardy does — coddle mediocre veterans while actively setting up younger players to fail. I’m not saying a young player should just be given a starting spot no matter what, but they should be given a reasonable chance to succeed.

]]> By: FunBobby http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1683 FunBobby Fri, 30 Jan 2009 21:52:23 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1683 <p>I don't think the position switch for Cuddyer was the driving force, it was the confidence. He knew right field was his, when he was at third he was constantly moving around and being benched. Another thing to consider is he was given a static spot in the lineup. Prior to 2006 when he was the everyday RF and 4th hitter, he was not only moving around the field on defense, but moving around in the order. Stability and routine is key with people as supersitious as baseball players.</p> I don’t think the position switch for Cuddyer was the driving force, it was the confidence. He knew right field was his, when he was at third he was constantly moving around and being benched. Another thing to consider is he was given a static spot in the lineup. Prior to 2006 when he was the everyday RF and 4th hitter, he was not only moving around the field on defense, but moving around in the order. Stability and routine is key with people as supersitious as baseball players.

]]> By: Erica http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1681 Erica Fri, 30 Jan 2009 21:27:44 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1681 <p>I see your point- but in both cases, Cuddyer and Casilla DID eventually become good major-league players. Maybe they simply needed more time. Both switched positions, and I wonder if that was a factor (in Cuddy's case, a BIG factor). I just don't feel too outraged when an absolute rookie isn't given significant trust or playing time during their first year. It's reasonable to expect them to earn it. Casilla certainly didn't light the world on fire when he came up in '07, and maybe getting a dose of reality with the club helped him when he came up again last year.</p> I see your point- but in both cases, Cuddyer and Casilla DID eventually become good major-league players. Maybe they simply needed more time. Both switched positions, and I wonder if that was a factor (in Cuddy’s case, a BIG factor). I just don’t feel too outraged when an absolute rookie isn’t given significant trust or playing time during their first year. It’s reasonable to expect them to earn it. Casilla certainly didn’t light the world on fire when he came up in ‘07, and maybe getting a dose of reality with the club helped him when he came up again last year.

]]> By: sirsean http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1680 sirsean Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:44:12 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1680 <p>There was an incident involving an alarm clock that Gardy did not forgive Casilla for, and Gardy repeatedly benched Casilla after both good and bad performances. All players agree that it's impossible to play well when you're constantly looking over your shoulder worrying about your playing time should you make a mistake; Cuddyer didn't meet his offensive or defensive promise until Gardy finally decided to give him a position, make him a starter, and leave him alone. At that point, he could relax and play.</p> <p>Casilla didn't get that chance until 2008, and he should have gotten it a year earlier. This is one of my recurring problems with Gardenhire as a manager.</p> There was an incident involving an alarm clock that Gardy did not forgive Casilla for, and Gardy repeatedly benched Casilla after both good and bad performances. All players agree that it’s impossible to play well when you’re constantly looking over your shoulder worrying about your playing time should you make a mistake; Cuddyer didn’t meet his offensive or defensive promise until Gardy finally decided to give him a position, make him a starter, and leave him alone. At that point, he could relax and play.

Casilla didn’t get that chance until 2008, and he should have gotten it a year earlier. This is one of my recurring problems with Gardenhire as a manager.

]]> By: Erica http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1679 Erica Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:40:21 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1679 <p>I can't really argue about Casilla's situation in '07 because I wasn't able to follow the games closely that year (so glad I got the MLB package last season). What do you mean by "treating him worse?" Giving him less playing time or being unfriendly, or what? I seem to recall lots of lousy defense from Casilla during his time with the Twins, and that may have influenced Gardy's decision about playing time. </p> <p>Gardy doesn't have to prove himself to the rookies- they have to prove themselves to him. There should be no sense of entitlement from ANY rookie, no matter how good they are.</p> I can’t really argue about Casilla’s situation in ‘07 because I wasn’t able to follow the games closely that year (so glad I got the MLB package last season). What do you mean by “treating him worse?” Giving him less playing time or being unfriendly, or what? I seem to recall lots of lousy defense from Casilla during his time with the Twins, and that may have influenced Gardy’s decision about playing time.

Gardy doesn’t have to prove himself to the rookies- they have to prove themselves to him. There should be no sense of entitlement from ANY rookie, no matter how good they are.

]]> By: sirsean http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1678 sirsean Fri, 30 Jan 2009 19:22:28 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1678 <p>By "same outcome," I meant the one that is currently happening -- Mijares freaking out and walking out on the team.</p> <p>And Casilla should have been contributing more significantly earlier; if only Gardy hadn't treated him worse than other, older, less talented players.</p> By “same outcome,” I meant the one that is currently happening — Mijares freaking out and walking out on the team.

And Casilla should have been contributing more significantly earlier; if only Gardy hadn’t treated him worse than other, older, less talented players.

]]> By: Erica http://firegardy.com/2009/01/30/mijares-and-the-adventure-in-venezuela/comment-page-1/#comment-1677 Erica Fri, 30 Jan 2009 19:14:55 +0000 http://firegardy.com/?p=342#comment-1677 <p>If Gardy treats Mijares like Casilla and it gets the same result (given this scenario, Mijares will come up in 2010, become a fixture of the roster immediately, and help the team contend for a division title), I'm okay with it.</p> If Gardy treats Mijares like Casilla and it gets the same result (given this scenario, Mijares will come up in 2010, become a fixture of the roster immediately, and help the team contend for a division title), I’m okay with it.

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